Errors-To: owner-tmbg-digest@tmbg.org Reply-To: tmbg-digest@tmbg.org Sender: owner-tmbg-digest@tmbg.org Precedence: bulk From: owner-tmbg-digest@tmbg.org To: tmbg-digest@tmbg.org Subject: tmbg-list Digest, Volume 42, Number 19 tmbg-list Digest, Volume 42, Number 19 Tuesday, 19 June 2001 Topics: TMBG: Re: tmbg-list Digest #42-18 Re: TMBG: Re: tmbg-list Digest #42-18 mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) TMBG: Re: tmbg-list Digest #42-17 Re: TMBG: Proposed TMBG site Re: TMBG: Proposed TMBG site TMBG: Little note for the UK Fans, Re: TMBG: Re: (none) Re: TMBG: Proposed TMBG site Re: TMBG: Man, it's so demo-y in here TMBG: Re: Woo UK TMBG: Re: The Once and Future Edith Head Re: TMBG: Re: Woo UK Re: TMBG: Proposed TMBG site Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Re: TMBG: Re: Woo UK Re[2]: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Re: Re[2]: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Re: Re[2]: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) TMBG: New York City show coming up, being filmed for the documentary Re[2]: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Re: Re[2]: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) TMBG: Re: mp3 files Administrivia: For all administrative issues, such as change of address, withdrawal from the list, etc., send a message to the following address: ÁÁowner-tmbg-digest@tmbg.org The views expressed herein are those of the individual authors. tmbg-list is compiled with Digest 3.7b (John Relph ). ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 03:55:06 EDT From: Instaboy@aol.com Subject: TMBG: Re: tmbg-list Digest #42-18 Message-ID: <30.165ab66e.285f0dda@aol.com> <> What makes you think I was replying to you? If I was replying directly to you I would have quoted you. I was actually referring to a situation with Weezer. This 13 year old kid told me I was not a true fan because I think "Green" is merely an ok pop album. I saw the words "true fan" mentioned and wanted to voice frustration in general about the tossing around of the label based on what I had faced with a different band but a similar situation. I didn't think you would assume I was referring directly to you. Next time, to avoid putting your foot in your mouth... You get the idea. Sorry if I somehow offended you. george ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 13:03:34 From: "John Ferrer" Subject: Re: TMBG: Re: tmbg-list Digest #42-18 Message-ID: [Unknown MIME type or encoding (text/html), contents not processed] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 08:35:23 -0600 From: Russ Josephson Subject: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Message-ID: <3B2E11AB.FA665A98@st.com> Organization: STMicroelectronics, Inc > Date: Sun, 17 Jun 2001 12:57:03 -0700 > From: "Bryan T. Hoerber" > Subject: TMBG: UnLtd > Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20010617125250.00aa2be8@pop3.norton.antivirus> > > I like the idea of UnLtd and the ability to leech all I want from > eMusic.com. But there is one thing that really annoys me to no end. The > fact that they use that pseudo CD-Quality that everyone thinks is great. I > personally can't stand 128KBit - Joint Stereo MP3s. I hear too many digital > artifacts. It sounds like the drums are under water. If they must use 128 > KBit they should at least make the files true stereo. All of their MP3s are > like this. And what is up with that recording of the Ritz show that was on > May's UnLtd? It sounded really tinny and distorted. > Hi Bryan, I'm just getting into mp3s (bought a CD-portable which plays thgem), so I'm curious. You don't like 128 Kbps data rate. What _DO_ you like? What's "Joint Stereo"? Are there other kinds of Stereo? How about quadraphonic? ÁÁRuss ======================================================================== Russ Josephson http://www.geocities.com/russj_yah Berthoud, Colorado, USA mailto:russj@juno.com "... not everyone is passionate about music ..." -- Joe Jackson "I took off the intellectuals, and put on There May Be Giants" -- Gloria "It is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do" -- 2 Nephi 25:23 ======================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 10:05:15 -0500 From: "Polaris" Subject: TMBG: Re: tmbg-list Digest #42-17 Message-ID: <9gl4ul$p30$1@ussenterprise.ufp.org> Organization: They Might Be Giants, Unofficially http://www.tmbg.org > everything in us resembles god... except for one thing The fact that we have corporeal form and severely limited power? ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 16:23:40 -0000 From: "Nathan Mulac DeHoff" Subject: Re: TMBG: Proposed TMBG site Message-ID: John Ferrer: >I was going to do almost the exact same thing, but didn't have enough >free >time to do it as well as it should be done. So I think it's a >FANTASTIC >idea. I didn't even know about the Discworld references. Some of them are mentioned in the Annotated Pratchett File (located at ), which is actually sort of close to what I would like to make for TMBG songs. >So if my vote counts, go for it! Only if you didn't vote using a robot. >I'll be glad to help any way I can, and if you're really hard up, I'll > >even tell you some of my ideas for the last one. (I was going to call >it >Encyclopedia T. Clever? Eh? Eh? Oh. Well. Maybe not.) I don't know if I'll use that name, but I'd like to know some of your other ideas. -- May the light shine upon thee, Nathan DinnerBell@tmbg.org http://www.geocities.com/fablesto/ _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com [Attachment omitted, unknown MIME type or encoding (message/rfc822)] ------------------------------ Date: Sat, 16 Jun 2001 19:22:17 From: "John Ferrer" Subject: Re: TMBG: Proposed TMBG site Message-ID: [Unknown MIME type or encoding (text/html), contents not processed] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 17:44:11 +0100 From: "Al" Subject: TMBG: Little note for the UK Fans, Message-ID: <000c01c0f815$e7e94500$2f9d893e@005282020097> Hi, A few weeks ago on Radio 2 Jonathon Ross played Unsupervised. I thought wow I've never heard that on UK Radio Yet, then last Week he played Twisting (no doubt due to the Pizza hut thing). Anyway I emailed him and the producer of his show says that they are going to be on this weeks saturday show around 11.30am. Just thought I'd share the info. AL ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 13:14:48 EDT From: Film2Edit@aol.com Subject: Re: TMBG: Re: (none) Message-ID: <68.103c8db3.285f9108@aol.com> *eats your cookie and offers everyone FigNewtons* ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 17:43:22 From: "John Ferrer" Subject: Re: TMBG: Proposed TMBG site Message-ID: [Unknown MIME type or encoding (text/html), contents not processed] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 14:05:50 -0400 From: "Bryce" Subject: Re: TMBG: Man, it's so demo-y in here Message-ID: <9glg4s$1bn7$1@ussenterprise.ufp.org> Organization: They Might Be Giants, Unofficially http://www.tmbg.org Nathan Mulac DeHoff : > ... I would encourage constructive criticism (along the lines > of "I think the live version of 'It's So Loud In Here' was better > than this Schlesinger mix because..."). The original version was creepier, especially the verses. It had a disoriented tension to it that the dance beat of the new version really undermines, if not obliterates, with its cheerful bounciness. Of course, I have mixed feelings about this because I like the high production value of the new version. And it's actually made me look more closely at the lyrics, which has resulted in a nascent interp that I'll be sharing with you all soon. They're both special in their own way. Can't we all just get along? > After all, isn't that partially what the list is for? Whatever gave you that idea? ;) Bryce Suspiciously change the subject. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 14:13:26 -0400 From: "Bryce" Subject: TMBG: Re: Woo UK Message-ID: <9glgkc$1cja$1@ussenterprise.ufp.org> Organization: They Might Be Giants, Unofficially http://www.tmbg.org wolfie : > official tmbg ambassador *of iowa > *(is it "of" or "to" ?) I believe it would be "to". Representing the interests of TMBG in a foreign land, one is an ambassador *from* TMBG *to* wherever. Bryce, TMBG Ambassador to Hawaii A floating island was his home. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 14:18:58 -0400 From: "Bryce" Subject: TMBG: Re: The Once and Future Edith Head Message-ID: <9glgtg$1dac$1@ussenterprise.ufp.org> Organization: They Might Be Giants, Unofficially http://www.tmbg.org Okay, having heard the "quiet version" they performed at the Bowery Ballroom on April 30, I have to say this June Unlimited version was very dissatisfying. The instrumentation from the Long Tall Weekend version, now reused, sounded much better with the original screaming vocals. To mellow out the song, it wasn't enough to redo the vocals, they need to redo the whole thing. I *really* hope they do, if they're putting this on Mink Car. Bryce I heard she changed. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 11:24:05 -0700 (PDT) From: Adam Piontek Subject: Re: TMBG: Re: Woo UK Message-ID: <20010618182405.94866.qmail@web13807.mail.yahoo.com> --- Bryce wrote: > Representing the > interests of TMBG in a foreign > land, one is an ambassador *from* TMBG *to* > wherever. Oh, is *that* what you're all doing? I thought everyone was just using their computer to waste time when they could instead be doing something positive to advance humanity like learning Finnish or how to fly space shuttles. -Adam __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Spot the hottest trends in music, movies, and more. http://buzz.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 13:39:13 -0500 From: Mitch Harding Subject: Re: TMBG: Proposed TMBG site Message-ID: <3B2E4AD1.69473682@tmbg.org> That sounds like a good idea. Another good thing to put on the site would be a Java applet, or something along those lines, that let you communicate with dead people. I'm thinking you'd have a pulldown menu that would let you select the dead person you want to talk to (with maybe a text box to type in people who aren't on the list), and then a text box where you type your message, and then a send button. The applet would send the message to the appropriate stiff, and then it would relay their message back to you. This probably would attract non-TMBGers to the site also, which is good, it could get the Johns some publicity. I'd write the applet myself, but I'm kinda busy at work right now. Plus, I don't know how to contact dead people, much less do so in Java. I think Perl or TCL might be able to do it, though. Anybody know? I think this is a worthwhile project. Mitch www.mitcharf.com John Ferrer wrote: > > I first had the idea when I saw a really fantastic site for the band > XTC called Your Dictionary. Now it's part of a bigger site and you can > find it at > http://website.lineone.net/~ssleightholm/dict/glossary/xtcglos.htm . > My idea was there would be sort of two ways of using the encyclopedia > (or whatever you would call it.) One was that you could search by > song, and every single song had a listing, with what different parts > of the song referenced or meant or whatever. And the other way was > just like an encyclopedia. You just had listings for everything, which > lead to an explanation of what it was and what it had to do with TMBG. > If that makes any sense. So you could look up something simple, like > "ANGELS" and it would tell you all the times TMBG has mentioned > angels. And you could look up something more specific, like "THE DB'S" > and it would tell you that dB's were a band headed by Marshall! > Crenshaw, and they're mentioned in the song "Twisting." And that was > about the gist of it. The idea was to constantly add new entries, to > keep it fun to come back. > > >From: "Nathan Mulac DeHoff" > >Reply-To: "Nathan Mulac DeHoff" > >To: tmbg-list@tmbg.org > >Subject: Re: TMBG: Proposed TMBG site > >Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 16:23:40 -0000 > > > >John Ferrer: > >>I was going to do almost the exact same thing, but didn't have > >>enough >free > >>time to do it as well as it should be done. So I think it's a > >> >FANTASTIC > >>idea. I didn't even know about the Discworld references. > > > >Some of them are mentioned in the Annotated Pratchett File (located > >at > >), which is > >actually sort > >of close to what I would like to make for TMBG songs. > > > >>So if my vote counts, go for it! > > > >Only if you didn't vote using a robot. > > > >>I'll be glad to help any way I can, and if you're really hard up, > >>I'll > >> >even tell you some of my ideas for the last one. (I was going to > >>call >it > >>Encyclopedia T. Clever? Eh? Eh? Oh. Well. Maybe not.) > > > >I don't know if I'll use that name, but I'd like to know some of > >your other > >ideas. > >-- > >May the light shine upon thee, > >Nathan > >DinnerBell@tmbg.org > >http://www.geocities.com/fablesto/ > > > >_________________________________________________________________ > >Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > ><< message3.txt >> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 12:07:51 -0700 From: "Bryan T. Hoerber" Subject: Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20010618120424.00a66728@mail.aviationpage.com> Well personally I prefer 192KBit true Stereo. I believe what joint stereo does is if there is a sound that is the same on the left and right channel it combines it and makes it mono. But when the sound is different enough on the left and right channel then it goes back to left and right. It creates a weird fluttering sound. True stereo leaves the recording as is. Left and right. Nothing combined. A lot of people tell me there isn't much of a difference. Well I guess I am an audiophile then. I can identify between the different bit rates and if they are mono, stereo, or joint stereo. I can even tell the difference when Linux and Windows are playing MP3 files. And don't get me started on Microsoft's WMA format. It just sounds like crap. At 07:35 AM 6/18/2001, you wrote: >Hi Bryan, > >I'm just getting into mp3s (bought a CD-portable which plays thgem), so >I'm curious. You don't like 128 Kbps data rate. What _DO_ you like? >What's "Joint Stereo"? Are there other kinds of Stereo? How about >quadraphonic? > > Russ >======================================================================== >Russ Josephson http://www.geocities.com/russj_yah >Berthoud, Colorado, USA mailto:russj@juno.com > >"... not everyone is passionate about music ..." -- Joe Jackson >"I took off the intellectuals, and put on There May Be Giants" -- Gloria >"It is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do" -- 2 Nephi 25:23 >======================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 12:09:04 -0700 From: "Bryan T. Hoerber" Subject: Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20010618120806.00a5fd38@mail.aviationpage.com> Oh yea, cool on your purchase of a CD Player with built in MP3 decoder. I got one of those too but I made the mistake of getting one that didn't support VBR nor bit rates past 128KBit. So I ended up getting me a Neo25 MP3 player. At 07:35 AM 6/18/2001, you wrote: >Hi Bryan, > >I'm just getting into mp3s (bought a CD-portable which plays thgem), so >I'm curious. You don't like 128 Kbps data rate. What _DO_ you like? >What's "Joint Stereo"? Are there other kinds of Stereo? How about >quadraphonic? > > Russ >======================================================================== >Russ Josephson http://www.geocities.com/russj_yah >Berthoud, Colorado, USA mailto:russj@juno.com > >"... not everyone is passionate about music ..." -- Joe Jackson >"I took off the intellectuals, and put on There May Be Giants" -- Gloria >"It is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do" -- 2 Nephi 25:23 >======================================================================== ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 15:15:37 -0400 From: "Father Bingo" Subject: Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Message-ID: <9glk3f$1in1$1@ussenterprise.ufp.org> Organization: Make Them Look what's your take on VBR? i am addicted to it, just to watch the numbers bounce around in winamp. everything i encode has a low of 80 and high of 320, and it really seems to make a difference in sound as well as file size. "Bryan T. Hoerber" wrote in message news:5.0.2.1.2.20010618120424.00a66728@mail.aviationpage.com... > Well personally I prefer 192KBit true Stereo. I believe what joint stereo > does is if there is a sound that is the same on the left and right channel > it combines it and makes it mono. But when the sound is different enough on > the left and right channel then it goes back to left and right. It creates > a weird fluttering sound. > > True stereo leaves the recording as is. Left and right. Nothing combined. > > A lot of people tell me there isn't much of a difference. Well I guess I am > an audiophile then. I can identify between the different bit rates and if > they are mono, stereo, or joint stereo. I can even tell the difference when > Linux and Windows are playing MP3 files. And don't get me started on > Microsoft's WMA format. It just sounds like crap. > > > At 07:35 AM 6/18/2001, you wrote: > >Hi Bryan, > > > >I'm just getting into mp3s (bought a CD-portable which plays thgem), so > >I'm curious. You don't like 128 Kbps data rate. What _DO_ you like? > >What's "Joint Stereo"? Are there other kinds of Stereo? How about > >quadraphonic? > > > > Russ > >======================================================================== > >Russ Josephson http://www.geocities.com/russj_yah > >Berthoud, Colorado, USA mailto:russj@juno.com > > > >"... not everyone is passionate about music ..." -- Joe Jackson > >"I took off the intellectuals, and put on There May Be Giants" -- Gloria > >"It is by grace that we are saved, after all we can do" -- 2 Nephi 25:23 > >======================================================================== > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 12:24:11 -0700 From: "Bryan T. Hoerber" Subject: Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.0.20010618122157.00ab1538@mail.aviationpage.com> I don't mind VBR. But a lot of those CD Players with built in Decoder seem to choke on it. Also I find that sometimes the time length of song will get misreported in the play list. The only recordings I use VBR on are the early songs from Glenn Miller and Benny Goodman and I tell it not to go past 64KBit since the original isn't that HiFi any ways. Oh yea. There is one fatal flaw with MP3 that I still wish they would fix, the fact that MP3s have a 16KHz Ceiling. Everything above 16KHz is just discarded. At 12:15 PM 6/18/2001, Father Bingo wrote: >what's your take on VBR? i am addicted to it, just to watch the numbers >bounce around in winamp. everything i encode has a low of 80 and high of >320, and it really seems to make a difference in sound as well as file size. ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 15:32:31 -0400 From: "Father Bingo" Subject: Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Message-ID: <9gll35$1kho$1@ussenterprise.ufp.org> Organization: Make Them Look you might find this article interesting, then. http://pcworld.idg.com.au/pcw.nsf/allonline/6F52 "Bryan T. Hoerber" wrote in message news:5.0.2.1.0.20010618122157.00ab1538@mail.aviationpage.com... > I don't mind VBR. But a lot of those CD Players with built in Decoder seem > to choke on it. Also I find that sometimes the time length of song will get > misreported in the play list. The only recordings I use VBR on are the > early songs from Glenn Miller and Benny Goodman and I tell it not to go > past 64KBit since the original isn't that HiFi any ways. > > Oh yea. There is one fatal flaw with MP3 that I still wish they would fix, > the fact that MP3s have a 16KHz Ceiling. Everything above 16KHz is just > discarded. > > > At 12:15 PM 6/18/2001, Father Bingo wrote: > >what's your take on VBR? i am addicted to it, just to watch the numbers > >bounce around in winamp. everything i encode has a low of 80 and high of > >320, and it really seems to make a difference in sound as well as file size. > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 12:51:22 -0700 From: "Bryan T. Hoerber" Subject: Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20010618124627.00a9c840@mail.aviationpage.com> WOW! I can't wait to try that new CODEC. I wonder where I can get my hands on it. Do you think eMusic.com will use that one so their files will sound better and not sound like they are under water? As for portable players the CD route is the cheaper way to go but you still are plagued by the same issues that a normal CD player has. They skip. I found this out myself. So I ended up getting me a Neo25 MP3 player. It has a built in 18GB HDD so it can store over 8000 hours of music. That just leaves the battery life issue but with the latest firmware they say you can get up to 4 hours on the LithIon rechargeable. At 12:32 PM 6/18/2001, you wrote: >you might find this article interesting, then. >http://pcworld.idg.com.au/pcw.nsf/allonline/6F52 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 16:02:59 -0400 From: scratch Subject: Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Message-ID: <3B2E5E73.8498892D@the-pentagon.com> Organization: They Might Be Giants, Unofficially http://www.tmbg.org Actually, I haven't tried it myself, but I heard a more technical explanation that claims that it doesn't actually record the high-end stuff, the "track" for it keeps track of when it happens, and then it is generated on playback. If that's true, I'm sure it will sound a lot worse. -scratch "Bryan T. Hoerber" wrote: > > WOW! I can't wait to try that new CODEC. I wonder where I can get my hands > on it. Do you think eMusic.com will use that one so their files will sound > better and not sound like they are under water? > > As for portable players the CD route is the cheaper way to go but you still > are plagued by the same issues that a normal CD player has. They skip. I > found this out myself. So I ended up getting me a Neo25 MP3 player. It has > a built in 18GB HDD so it can store over 8000 hours of music. That just > leaves the battery life issue but with the latest firmware they say you can > get up to 4 hours on the LithIon rechargeable. > > At 12:32 PM 6/18/2001, you wrote: > >you might find this article interesting, then. > >http://pcworld.idg.com.au/pcw.nsf/allonline/6F52 ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 16:04:31 -0400 From: scratch Subject: Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Message-ID: <3B2E5ECF.B23077F8@the-pentagon.com> Organization: They Might Be Giants, Unofficially http://www.tmbg.org "Bryan T. Hoerber" wrote: > > Oh yea. There is one fatal flaw with MP3 that I still wish they would fix, > the fact that MP3s have a 16KHz Ceiling. Everything above 16KHz is just > discarded. Not true, it all depends on your codec. Some actually go up to 22KHz, which is overkill in most cases since CDs cut off at 20KHz. LAME lets you set the cutoff yourself. -scratch ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 14:07:46 -0600 From: "makebase" Subject: Re: TMBG: Re: Woo UK Message-ID: <9gln7a$1obu$1@ussenterprise.ufp.org> Organization: They Might Be Giants, Unofficially http://www.tmbg.org I thought the whole ambassadorship idea was to accumulate power, inflate your ego and further your own personal interests. I'm too nearsighted to fly a paper airplane and I've had no luck with non-Indoeuropean languages. However, I am an excelent diplomat. I believe I can still further the interents of TMBG as Utah Ambassador v2.0. Shaun TMBG Ambassador *to* Utah, People's Republic of "Reading the next resume, lifting his eyes up from the page..." Adam Piontek wrote in message news:20010618182405.94866.qmail@web13807.mail.yahoo.com... > --- Bryce wrote: > > Representing the > > interests of TMBG in a foreign > > land, one is an ambassador *from* TMBG *to* > > wherever. > > Oh, is *that* what you're all doing? I thought > everyone was just using their computer to waste time > when they could instead be doing something positive to > advance humanity like learning Finnish or how to fly > space shuttles. > > -Adam > > > __________________________________________________ > Do You Yahoo!? > Spot the hottest trends in music, movies, and more. > http://buzz.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 16:31:08 -0400 From: karinh@sterl.com Subject: Re[2]: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Message-ID: <134703879@sterl.com> ***DISCLAIMER*** - - - ***This is in no way aimed at Bryan T personally, it is purely a sociological rant*** Bryan T. sez: >So I ended up getting me a Neo25 MP3 player. It has >a built in 18GB HDD so it can store over 8000 hours of music. I'm sorry, I'm old and not totally up with the latest technological miracles, but... WHO NEEDS TO STORE OVER 8000 HOURS OF MUSIC????? Ahem, sorry for shouting.... but really, now. Do any of us even **know** enough music to fill up an 8,000 hr, 18 GB HD? I did a little rough math, at ~5 min. per song, that would be 96,000 songs. Or 3200 2.5 hr concerts. And the d/l time, even with the zippiest cable modem out there, you can kiss your social life goodbye, you're gonna be on your ass staring at k per sec meters while all your friends are out HAVING FUN !!!! And something tells me that you probly can't listen to the music you've already recorded while you're busy recording more, though I could be wrong about that. BUT STILL..... If anyone can explain, justify, or rationalize this, I'd love to hear it. To me, this is right up there with the stretch-SUV limo for pure third-millenium American hubris. This is the kind of stuff George Carlin lives for.... Karin H ** FREE THE EXPO 67 ** ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 14:38:50 -0600 From: "makebase" Subject: Re: Re[2]: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Message-ID: <9glp1p$1rji$1@ussenterprise.ufp.org> Organization: They Might Be Giants, Unofficially http://www.tmbg.org This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ------=_NextPart_000_0078_01C0F804.6486FE20 Content-Type: text/plain; ÁÁcharset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable The rationale for this is pretty much the same as wasting your time on = mailing lists and newsgroups. Besides, this is America, and we all know = that, whether it's 18 GB HDs or anything else, it's not how you use it = but SIZE that matters! Don't take this as a personal attack however. I = still support the Expo 67 Liberation Front. Shaun TMBG Ambassador Extraodinaire wrote in message news:134703879@sterl.com... you can kiss your social life goodbye, you're gonna be on your ass = staring at k per sec meters while all your friends are out HAVING FUN=20 If anyone can explain, justify, or rationalize this, I'd love to hear = it. To me, this is right up there with the stretch-SUV limo for pure = third-millenium American hubris. This is the kind of stuff George = Carlin lives for.... Karin H ** FREE THE EXPO 67 ** =20 ------=_NextPart_000_0078_01C0F804.6486FE20 Content-Type: text/html; ÁÁcharset="iso-8859-1" Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
The rationale for this is pretty much = the same as=20 wasting your time on mailing lists and newsgroups.  Besides, this = is=20 America, and we all know that, whether it's 18 GB HDs or anything else, = it's not=20 how you use it but SIZE that matters!  Don't take this as a = personal attack=20 however.  I still support the Expo 67 Liberation = Front.
 
Shaun
TMBG Ambassador = Extraodinaire
 
<karinh@sterl.com> = wrote in=20 message news:134703879@sterl.com...

you can kiss your social life goodbye, you're gonna be on = your ass=20 staring at k per sec meters while all your friends are out HAVING FUN=20

If anyone can = explain, justify,=20 or rationalize this, I'd love to hear it.  To me, this is right = up there=20 with the stretch-SUV limo for pure third-millenium American = hubris.  This=20 is the kind of stuff George Carlin lives for....

        Karin H

** FREE THE EXPO 67 = **  

------=_NextPart_000_0078_01C0F804.6486FE20-- ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 15:44:25 -0500 From: Mitch Harding Subject: Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Message-ID: <3B2E6829.6732682E@tmbg.org> << WHO NEEDS TO STORE OVER 8000 HOURS OF MUSIC????? >> The 8000 hours part might be missing the point. The player in question had 18 GB of storage, which may be able to hold up to 8000 hours, but will likely end up storing much less, if they are encoded at a higher bitrate. I know that I personally have over 10 GB of MP3s on my hard drive. I have encoded all of my CDs, and I've got a bunch of MP3s from the net. Given that I buy new CDs regularly, it seems likely that I will exceed 18 GB sooner or later. Of course nobody *needs* to store 8000 hours of music. Nobody needs to have any music, when it comes down to it. But I like music, I find MP3s the most convenient method for listening to music, so I can appreciate something with 18 GB of storage. Mitch! www.mitcharf.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 13:51:57 -0700 From: "Bryan T. Hoerber" Subject: Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20010618135054.00a714c8@mail.aviationpage.com> Yea, that's what I gathered too. I guess I will have to wait and hear. It would have more information on the higher end giving it more dynamic quality but I dunno how that generation effect will sound. Probably something like a MIDI file? At 01:02 PM 6/18/2001, you wrote: >Actually, I haven't tried it myself, but I heard a more technical >explanation that claims that it doesn't actually record the high-end >stuff, the "track" for it keeps track of when it happens, and then it is >generated on playback. If that's true, I'm sure it will sound a lot >worse. > >-scratch ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 13:52:58 -0700 From: "Bryan T. Hoerber" Subject: Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20010618135225.00a6c190@mail.aviationpage.com> I use LAME and BLADE, where can I set the cutoff cause on frequency analysis it still has the 16KHz cutoff? At 01:04 PM 6/18/2001, you wrote: >"Bryan T. Hoerber" wrote: > > > > Oh yea. There is one fatal flaw with MP3 that I still wish they would fix, > > the fact that MP3s have a 16KHz Ceiling. Everything above 16KHz is just > > discarded. > >Not true, it all depends on your codec. Some actually go up to 22KHz, >which is overkill in most cases since CDs cut off at 20KHz. LAME lets >you set the cutoff yourself. > >-scratch ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 20:55:37 -0000 From: "Nathan Mulac DeHoff" Subject: Re: Re[2]: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Message-ID: Karin: >If anyone can explain, justify, or rationalize this, I'd love to hear it. >To me, this is right up there with the stretch-SUV limo for pure >third-millenium American hubris. And what about mink cars? -- May the light shine upon thee, Nathan DinnerBell@tmbg.org http://www.geocities.com/fablesto/ Okay, now we're back on topic. _________________________________________________________________ Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 16:55:02 -0400 From: "The Demonic Kangaroo" Subject: TMBG: New York City show coming up, being filmed for the Message-ID: <9glppt$1tb4$1@ussenterprise.ufp.org> Organization: They Might Be Giants, Unofficially http://www.tmbg.org documentary I was just talking to AJ Schnack, the director of the upcoming TMBG documentary who told me that soon a NYC show will be announced - a show that is being scheduled for late July or early August specifically to be filmed for his production. He said the place/day has not been decided yet, but keep on the lookout for more info. He also mentioned that there may be some sort of audience participation during the show. See you there!! -Mike www.theymightbegiants.org ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 13:57:28 -0700 From: "Bryan T. Hoerber" Subject: Re[2]: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20010618135350.00a6d388@mail.aviationpage.com> [Unknown MIME type or encoding (text/html), contents not processed] ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 14:02:13 -0700 From: "Bryan T. Hoerber" Subject: Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20010618135848.00b19dd8@mail.aviationpage.com> Exactly! I love music too. I have quite a few TMBG CDs which I listen to all the time. Well the MP3 files any ways. And what about albums like Long Tall Weekend which is available only in MP3? Decode it to wav then burn it to CD audio? I THINK NOT! I'll leave it in MP3. For me it is just having all my music at my finger tips instead of having to dig through CDs. As far as amounts go. 20 GB of MP3s mostly at 192KBit and a lot of 128KBit the total number of tracks is 4,818. To me that isn't a lot. Especially when you put it on random and it keeps playing the same 60 songs over and over? *SIGH* I wish they would design a better randomizer. So maybe a Neo25 isn't their thing. That's why the market is flooded with 64MB solid state MP3 players. If you just want to listen to one album at a time then that is the better solution. For me the Neo25 is the better solution. Soon I plan on getting the Neo35 which has a removable rack-mount HDD system for the car that fits under the seat. At 01:44 PM 6/18/2001, you wrote: ><< WHO NEEDS TO STORE OVER 8000 HOURS OF MUSIC????? >> > >The 8000 hours part might be missing the point. The player in question >had 18 GB of storage, which may be able to hold up to 8000 hours, but >will likely end up storing much less, if they are encoded at a higher >bitrate. I know that I personally have over 10 GB of MP3s on my hard >drive. I have encoded all of my CDs, and I've got a bunch of MP3s from >the net. Given that I buy new CDs regularly, it seems likely that I >will exceed 18 GB sooner or later. > >Of course nobody *needs* to store 8000 hours of music. Nobody needs to >have any music, when it comes down to it. But I like music, I find MP3s >the most convenient method for listening to music, so I can appreciate >something with 18 GB of storage. > >Mitch! >www.mitcharf.com ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 14:03:32 -0700 From: "Bryan T. Hoerber" Subject: Re: Re[2]: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20010618140307.00a6bc60@mail.aviationpage.com> Oh so fuzzy,...... I like fur....... *mrrrrrr* YIP! At 01:55 PM 6/18/2001, you wrote: >Karin: >>If anyone can explain, justify, or rationalize this, I'd love to hear it. >>To me, this is right up there with the stretch-SUV limo for pure >>third-millenium American hubris. > >And what about mink cars? >-- >May the light shine upon thee, >Nathan >DinnerBell@tmbg.org >http://www.geocities.com/fablesto/ > >Okay, now we're back on topic. > >_________________________________________________________________ >Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com > > ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 17:39:30 -0400 From: scratch Subject: Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Message-ID: <3B2E7512.1F721EE7@the-pentagon.com> Organization: They Might Be Giants, Unofficially http://www.tmbg.org Use the --lowpass # argument, replacing # with the desired cutoff frequency in KHz. If you use a GUI frontend for it, you'll have to find the way to set this in the frontend. -scratch "Bryan T. Hoerber" wrote: > > I use LAME and BLADE, where can I set the cutoff cause on frequency > analysis it still has the 16KHz cutoff? > > At 01:04 PM 6/18/2001, you wrote: > > >"Bryan T. Hoerber" wrote: > > > > > > Oh yea. There is one fatal flaw with MP3 that I still wish they would fix, > > > the fact that MP3s have a 16KHz Ceiling. Everything above 16KHz is just > > > discarded. > > > >Not true, it all depends on your codec. Some actually go up to 22KHz, > >which is overkill in most cases since CDs cut off at 20KHz. LAME lets > >you set the cutoff yourself. > > > >-scratch ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 14:48:51 -0700 From: "Bryan T. Hoerber" Subject: Re: mp3 files (was RE: TMBG: UnLtd) Message-ID: <5.0.2.1.2.20010618144704.00a713e8@mail.aviationpage.com> I'll look for it when I get home. I use DB Power Amp and it has a GUI frontend. Kind of curious though if some CODECs support going past that 16KHz ceiling then why does WinAmp's GEQ only top off at 16KHz? At 02:39 PM 6/18/2001, you wrote: >Use the --lowpass # argument, replacing # with the desired cutoff >frequency in KHz. If you use a GUI frontend for it, you'll have to find >the way to set this in the frontend. > >-scratch ------------------------------ Date: Mon, 18 Jun 2001 18:22:38 -0400 From: "Bryce" Subject: TMBG: Re: mp3 files Message-ID: <9glv6c$27b5$1@ussenterprise.ufp.org> Organization: They Might Be Giants, Unofficially http://www.tmbg.org Bryan T. Hoerber : > Especially when you put it on random and it keeps > playing the same 60 songs over and over? *SIGH* > I wish they would design a better randomizer. This is why I want to use my computer as my primary stereo component. I have a 50-CD changer at home, but the best random it can offer me is one randomly chosen song from each disc. Here at work, I've written a Tcl script that scans my drive for mp3s, builds up a list of all the titles I have, and feeds selections to Sonique (at the command line). The script selects songs at random, but only among songs that I haven't already heard that day. Even if what I've heard was a different version (say, one of the eleventeen remixes or live versions of Istanbul (Not Constantinople)), the others are still ruled out until I reset the list. I can also restrict the random selection to titles that match a regular expression, and I use this to play specific songs I suddenly decide I want to hear. Overkill? Maybe. :) But it's exactly what I want. Bryce By random whim one occurs to me. ------------------------------ End of tmbg-list Digest #42-19 ******************************